Wishlist

[Pibuz]

I though two things to be added in the wishlist! (...uhmmmm...I'm a wisher........)
...er BTW!
1. Since there is no apparent reason to have Groups and Components NOT instanced, could it be possible to automatize this feature? When there are 2 or more identical groups/components in a SU scene SkIndigo could automatically turn them to instances. A separate managing would still be requested to set dummies still..
2. Could it be possible to visually enhance the chosen kind of environment? I thought about structuring the three options (sun-sky/background color/environment) like drop down lists (as the "emitter attributes" and "mesh emission" panels in the mat editor are handled): once you've chosen one, the other ones are minimized or somehow freeze, so it's very clear which kind of environment you're actually using.

That's all! Welcome back Dale! How was Disneyland?

[Jeff Hammond]

I think the whole white balance thing can be redone.. some of it would probably have to take place in indigo and some in skindigo.

right now, there are a bunch of different scales being used of which i only recognize 2 of them.. kelvin (at least i think that's what the 9300 is) and spectral (d65 etc)
the order they are listed in from top to bottom is weird in that they go from cool to warm in groups of 2 or 3 instead of gradually warming throughout the list..

it's basically a guessing game to get the color balance right when in fact it could all done very accurately and easily (seeing how all the work is being done on a computer instead of in the field)

it'd be nice to have an adjustable kelvin scale in there (for example) or some other method that is much more understandable.. the whitepoint x & y?? what's that? .. i'm pretty sure nobody using this app knows what all that stuff means and/or how to use it properly so it shouldn't be in there in the way it is.. it has to be more user friendly (a lot more imo)

where skindigo comes into play is this: i feel like we should be able to take a reading in SU much the same way a photographer could do.. it could work something like the sun positioning tool.. we could place an 18% grey card in the scene and the white balance would be set off of that. (if you're shooting a photo, you can take a shot of the scene that has a grey card in it.. in photoshop, you'd click an eyedropper on the grey card and the rest of the color balance is set off it.. the grey card is made grey while all the other colors adjust accordingly)
the bonus is that we don't have to actually make a picture with the grey card in it and then adjust subsequent photos in similar lighting to the test picture.. it's all done with a mouse click in the actual frame being rendered)

mixed lighting poses a challenge for photogs but this also could be dealt with using the method described above.. if you have a scene with a fluorescent lit interior and sunlight from the outside, you could place your grey card accordingly.. do you want the balance set for the warmer sunlight or cooler florescent? etc... we'd just put our grey card in the area we want true or-- on or near an object in the scene that we want to be the correct color.

i'm not positive this is the best solution to the current white balance setup but i'm pretty sure something has to be done about it.. (or, i guess, i can continue to do the color balancing in photoshop but i really think it can be done as good as or better than using indigo itself)

[suvakas]

As an answer to Jeff's post and as an idea for Whaat.
One quick workaround is to include Kelvins in white balance preset names.
I'm using that approach in Maxigo. You can pick the right white balance according to what light temperature you have set.
Of course this would not work for RGB emitters. But it's still useful.

[OnoSendai]

I think the whole white balance thing can be redone.. some of it would probably have to take place in indigo and some in skindigo.

right now, there are a bunch of different scales being used of which i only recognize 2 of them.. kelvin (at least i think that's what the 9300 is) and spectral (d65 etc)
the order they are listed in from top to bottom is weird in that they go from cool to warm in groups of 2 or 3 instead of gradually warming throughout the list..

it's basically a guessing game to get the color balance right when in fact it could all done very accurately and easily (seeing how all the work is being done on a computer instead of in the field)

it'd be nice to have an adjustable kelvin scale in there (for example) or some other method that is much more understandable.. the whitepoint x & y?? what's that? .. i'm pretty sure nobody using this app knows what all that stuff means and/or how to use it properly so it shouldn't be in there in the way it is.. it has to be more user friendly (a lot more imo)

where skindigo comes into play is this: i feel like we should be able to take a reading in SU much the same way a photographer could do.. it could work something like the sun positioning tool.. we could place an 18% grey card in the scene and the white balance would be set off of that. (if you're shooting a photo, you can take a shot of the scene that has a grey card in it.. in photoshop, you'd click an eyedropper on the grey card and the rest of the color balance is set off it.. the grey card is made grey while all the other colors adjust accordingly)
the bonus is that we don't have to actually make a picture with the grey card in it and then adjust subsequent photos in similar lighting to the test picture.. it's all done with a mouse click in the actual frame being rendered)

mixed lighting poses a challenge for photogs but this also could be dealt with using the method described above.. if you have a scene with a fluorescent lit interior and sunlight from the outside, you could place your grey card accordingly.. do you want the balance set for the warmer sunlight or cooler florescent? etc... we'd just put our grey card in the area we want true or-- on or near an object in the scene that we want to be the correct color.

i'm not positive this is the best solution to the current white balance setup but i'm pretty sure something has to be done about it.. (or, i guess, i can continue to do the color balancing in photoshop but i really think it can be done as good as or better than using indigo itself)

Hi Jeff,
some very good points there.
I think at some point I'll add a whitepoint picker to the Indigo GUI, so that you can pick a point in the scene that should be white, and the whitepoint x and y will be calculated to make the point white.

[neo0.]

Great, post Jeff. The way I see it, Indigo is based on physical properties and that's a great thing because it allows you to produce some stunning renders. Problem is that, it gets a little too technical when it requires you to understand many of the gritty details behind the physics..

Personally, my biggest problem with su is the texture mapping.. It's not really clear, when you assign them, how things like bump and emission maps are syncronized with your other maps. I also feel like making the texture UI non overlapping (blender style) would be very beneficial.

Another thing that I really liked was the visual reference accompanying the color temperature. For me, using indigo requires that I open several references (one to know which temperature I need for my light sources, another for the whitepoint, etc.) Ideally, skindigo should have a visual reference to show you "if you drag the slider this way, the color will be coolor or if you drag it the other way, it will be more x".


More lighting presets would also be nice like...
-Neon lamp
-Light bulbs (I realize there are many, many brands, so just a few would do)
-Flourescent lamp (long glass tubes)
-Ultraviolet
-Laser
-LED
-etc

[suvakas]

Hi Jeff,
some very good points there.
I think at some point I'll add a whitepoint picker to the Indigo GUI, so that you can pick a point in the scene that should be white, and the whitepoint x and y will be calculated to make the point white.

That would be great !

[dakiru]

More lighting presets would also be nice like...
-Neon lamp
-Light bulbs (I realize there are many, many brands, so just a few would do)
-Flourescent lamp (long glass tubes)
-Ultraviolet
-Laser
-LED
-etc

I guess ultraviolet is not possible, because it is out of the visible spectrum.

Laser can be made with IES or parabolic mirror. I saw a topic about it somewhere on the forum.

[Jeff Hammond]

Hi Jeff,
some very good points there.
I think at some point I'll add a whitepoint picker to the Indigo GUI, so that you can pick a point in the scene that should be white, and the whitepoint x and y will be calculated to make the point white.

ha, yeah.. that sounds better than the method i've described..

[neo0.]

lol why didn't I remember that? We're learning about that in class right now.

Well maybe just something like this

[dakiru]

I think we are thinking of different things. You are speaking about the visible effect from the lamps (which can be achieved with RGB emitters). I am talking about the UV radiation wavelength in general.

Code: Select all

The sun emits electromagnetic radiation of different energy or wavelengths. Some of the radiation, such as that making up the colours of rainbow, is visible which our eyes can see. The part of radiation beyond the violet end of visible light is called ultraviolet(UV) radiation which our eyes cannot see....

ELM_spectrum_e.jpg (38.88 KiB) Viewed 11511 times

Code: Select all

A black light, or Wood's light, is a lamp that emits long wave UV radiation and very little visible light. Commonly these are referred to as simply a "UV light". Fluorescent black lights are typically made in the same fashion as normal fluorescent lights except that only one phosphor is used and the normally clear glass envelope of the bulb may be replaced by a deep-bluish-purple glass called Wood's glass, a nickel-oxide–doped glass, which blocks almost all visible light above 400 nanometers....

source 1
source 2

edit: I am sorry for off-topic

[neo0.]

Well, I figured it would be like a compramise.. Maybe indigo could even simulate the visible light that results when the invisible radiation interacts with objects if there is such a thing? I don't know.. I've seen things that glow under UV lights and/or become transparent..

Not really skindigo related, but how about simulation the light emitted from really hot metals? This would be useful for things like light bulbs..

[dakiru]

Not really skindigo related, but how about simulation the light emitted from really hot metals? This would be useful for things like light bulbs..

It's a blackbody radiation ---> blackbody emitters. I am very sure that they are present in Skindigo. Or no?

[Whaat]

I though two things to be added in the wishlist! (...uhmmmm...I'm a wisher........)
...er BTW!
1. Since there is no apparent reason to have Groups and Components NOT instanced, could it be possible to automatize this feature? When there are 2 or more identical groups/components in a SU scene SkIndigo could automatically turn them to instances. A separate managing would still be requested to set dummies still..

This feature is currently on the SkIndigo roadmap. However, it affects quite a few things so I have to do a lot of thinking and planning to make sure I do it right. It has a profound affect on the mesh subdivision workflow (that is the trickiest issue to deal with)

2. Could it be possible to visually enhance the chosen kind of environment? I thought about structuring the three options (sun-sky/background color/environment) like drop down lists (as the "emitter attributes" and "mesh emission" panels in the mat editor are handled): once you've chosen one, the other ones are minimized or somehow freeze, so it's very clear which kind of environment you're actually using.

Yes this could be improved.

How was Disneyland?

Great! I wish I was still there!

[neo0.]

Right now, when you render a preview for one material, that same material preview shows up for your other materials.. This is a little confusing.

[Whaat]

Right now, when you render a preview for one material, that same material preview shows up for your other materials.. This is a little confusing.

I'm a bit confused as to what you mean. Can you elaborate? What you are describing does not sound like anything I have experienced.