OK... This is driving me nuts!! JAGGIES

5OnIt · Post by **5OnIt** » Sun Mar 04, 2007 10:20 am

I keep getting jaggies when I render in Indigo no matter what I do! In this image I have six spheres. I started in Blender with the default UV sphere settings 32x32. I then used a subsurf level of 3. And before anyone asks... yes I applied the subsurf to the mesh before I exported the XML file to Indigo. Yet I'm still getting Jaggies!!! Just look at the spec highlights.

My XML file for this simple scene is already over 155 Megs. Do I really need to subdived the Mesh even more??

Thanks in advance,

Kram1032 · Post by **Kram1032** » Sun Mar 04, 2007 10:24 am

Use IcoSpheres and name them ___.sphere

Then, your file is much smaller AND you get better shaped spheres.
If you want to stay to UV-Spheres, which I wont do, you can test to press "to sphere" and say "OK"...

neepneep · Post by **neepneep** » Sun Mar 04, 2007 11:12 am

Click on 'Set Smooth' under Link&Materials...you didn't mention that you did that....

Also you dont have to apply the subsurf before exporting. The exporter will magically pick up on its setting and automatically export it (just the 'levels' slider and not the 'render levels')

5OnIt · Post by **5OnIt** » Sun Mar 04, 2007 11:38 am

Kram: Thanks, but I'm posting a sphere test just to show what problems I'm having. I've also had the same problems with other meshes, like the suzanne mesh.

neep: I think I did apply "Set Smooth." Are you saying I need to apply it after I subsurf? I usually do that before. As for applying the subsurf to the mesh, I'm just doing what is listed in the Blender/Indigo tutorial. I do notice that the tutorial is for Indigo 5 and the Indigo 5 exporter. Was this fixed in 6? That's what I'm using now.

Thanks for the suggestions guys, I'll try a few and see what I come up with.

Wedge · Post by **Wedge** » Sun Mar 04, 2007 4:47 pm

Hello!

Here is what I think is wrong:

Set Smooth would not change your image at all unless your using Indigo version 0.7 test 5 and a Blender 07 exporter (I say latest test because I think it is the one you should use, since bugs have been fixed along the test versions etc 1 2 3 4) where the normal smoothing tags were used. Also just setting normal smoothing to true in the xml will not do anything either. Pushing the button in Blender alters the mesh data exported by the exporter. That is why you need to both push the button and make sure your using indigo 07 test 5. The 07t5 Blender exporter I updated will use the smoothing if you click the set smooth button. I'm not sure how this is handled by the exporter Zuegs is working on.

This smoothing allows you to have a low quality sphere where you render it in Indigo the reflections on it will be very smooth. The geometry of this sphere will still be square-ish around the edges depending on your camera angle.

Subsurfing increases the data of the mesh and as you probably saw makes the mesh really big really fast. This makes for a big big xml file. And still leaves for a square-ish appearance in the reflection although they will get smaller and smaller the more you subsurf it. (likely why your spheres are starting to look like jaggies, its not aliasing but the geometry of the sphere, made up of little squares)

I imagine if you were using Indigo 07 and a Blender 07 exporter this same scene like you show above could be in an xml less than a MB size. The sphere could be primitives or set smoothed and they would look flawless. They could even be instanced.

And also .sphere to mesh name will not use any primitives unless your using exporters with this feature. The 07t5 exporter I work on uses these now and I think the one Zuegs is working on does too.

So in order to help we need to know what version of Indigo and what version of the Blender exporter you are using.

You said Indigo 06 and I think you are stuck with that result because normal smoothing was not in Indigo yet. And I do not think any Blender 06 exporters had primitives either. (Unless U3dreal included primitives in the 06 exporter, I don't remember and I never used it?)

You could always hand edit the xml file and put primitives in yourself, I suppose...

5OnIt · Post by **5OnIt** » Sun Mar 04, 2007 8:17 pm

Thanks Wedge, I guess what you say make sense seeing that I did another test after smoothing the mesh and it made no difference. I also have noticed this problem in other user's renders. Even the suzanne example in the 5.0 tutorial had it, I just don' think most people notice it.

So, I will try the lastest version of the export script along with the latest version of Indigo and see what happens.

Thanks again.

5OnIt · Post by **5OnIt** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 3:26 am

OK, tried the 0.7t5 version of Indigo and export script. This is what I got with the exact same settings in Blender that I had used before. Transparency is completely gone and even the regular 'diffuse' material doesn't look right. At least the jaggies are gone (mostly).

[/img]

Kram1032 · Post by **Kram1032** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 3:46 am

Do you use the new exporter? (One of the two)
There are some changes in the code in Indigo 0.7, so you need to use the new exporter, if you don't want to hand edit the xml-files.
Get Blendigo, by zuegs here

or
Get Wedge's Exporter here

You can use both exporters, as many seem to do...
I prefer Blendigo, as it's easier to get the correct material settings.
Wedge's is more simmilar to the 0.6 Exporter, on the other hand.
But you wont need long, to figure out, how Blendigo works!

joegiampaoli · Post by **joegiampaoli** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 7:05 am

5OnIt, Can you post your .blend and .xml files so I can do a check on them plz.

EDIT: Sorry I didn't see your xml file was more that 100 MB

, which shouldn't be that big, just post me the .blend file then...

5OnIt · Post by **5OnIt** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 9:05 am

Sure Joe.

I first need to find a place to put them. The .blend file is about 23 megs and the .xml file is about 155. I can put them on my server but I don't have a boatload of bandwidth, so downloading them may take a while. I'll repost to this thread once I have them someplace.

Kram: Yes - I used Wedge's 7t5 export script.

5OnIt · Post by **5OnIt** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 9:41 am

OK... Try this link.

http://home.pjwarez.com/emitterTest.blend.zip

joegiampaoli · Post by **joegiampaoli** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 5:34 pm

WOW

Your spheres are extremely subdivided! But not enough to appear as smooth surfaces.
It appears you didn't hit the smooth button on them, I clicked on one and then the smooth button and the little squares went away, so there's no need to subdivide so much, highest you wanna go on a sphere is maybe 64 and then smooth it, I'm gonna render a quickie and post it here for you.

joegiampaoli · Post by **joegiampaoli** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 5:57 pm

ok, I think it's taking a little too long to render because of the extreme sphere subdivisions, that's why your xml file is so big, you have to do what I told you with the spheres, don't make them larger than 64 subs and then smooth them, and in order to get the right materials, the easiest way is like Kram1032 said, use the exporters, I also use blendigo mostly to get my materials right, only thing is a little pain to set it up with a nice test scene to view your mats, for example I created my own to preview the materials, you also want to maybe use the nk data files for the chrome spheres, with a high exponent so you have more shiness reflection (like 5000 - 10000), once you have lower sub-spheres and smoothed out you will achieve a much smaller xml file and much faster renderings

If you want to use blendigo exporter here's my material preview scene, just extract it to indigo folder and then you can run your previews from blendigo.

5OnIt · Post by **5OnIt** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 6:05 pm

BUT I DID! I did hit the smooth button! In fact, I even hit it several times for a few of the spheres. So this begs the question, what am I doing wrong?? I noticed that there is a 'smooth' button under Mesh Tools and a 'set smooth' under the Mesh menu, do these both do the same thing? Should I do one and not the other?

joegiampaoli · Post by **joegiampaoli** » Wed Mar 07, 2007 6:09 pm

AHA!
Yes, you must only hit "Set Smooth" by the "Set Solid" button in Links and Materials menu

And just hit it once.

OK... This is driving me nuts!! JAGGIES

OK... This is driving me nuts!! JAGGIES

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